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Artwork for Assess THAT with Tom & Nat!

Assess THAT with Tom & Nat! (Assessment, Feedback, Grading, and Learning)

Tom Schimmer
Assessment
Education
Professional Development
Rubrics
Feedback
Common Formative Assessments
Formative Assessment
Teaching
Grading Trap
Student Engagement
K-12 Education
Student Agency
Culturally Responsive Teaching
Entrepreneurship
Grading Practices
Grading
Standardized Testing
Self-Assessment
Literacy
Storytelling

Assess THAT with Tom & Nat is a bi-weekly podcast where co-hosts Tom Schimmer and Natalie Vardabasso unpack what it really means to deepen assessment literacy in schools. Known for their dynamic, insightful, and sometimes provocative conversations, Tom and Nat create a space where educators can rethink grading, feedback, and accountability in ways that put student learning first. Each episode blen... more

PublishesTwice monthlyEpisodes100Founded6 years ago
Number of ListenersCategory
Education

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Artwork for Assess THAT with Tom & Nat!

Latest Episodes

Averaging feels neutral, objective, and mathematically sound, but in the context of student learning, it can quietly distort the story a grade is meant to tell. In this episode, Tom and Natalie take a deep dive into the statistics that dominate most ... more

Across education, we hear constant concern about teacher shortages. On the surface, it seems like recruitment pipelines, retention rates, burnout, and workload are the issues. But beneath those very real challenges lies a quieter, more systemic issue... more

In this episode, Tom and Nat explore a tension many educators are feeling right now: our deep desire to be compassionate in assessment and the unintended consequences that can arise when compassion gets confused with lowering expectations. Responding... more

AI has sparked fear, urgency, and a wave of reactionary policies in schools, but what if the real issue isn’t the technology itself? In this episode, Tom and Natalie argue that AI didn’t break assessment; it exposed long-standing weaknesses in task d... more

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Recent Guests

Josh Ogilvie
Educator and thought leader who focuses on student motivation and engagement
Canadian Assessment Consultants
Episode: 26 - Motivation and Assessment: Designing the Conditions for Learning with Josh Ogilvie
Danielle Paloposki
Educator and consultant dedicated to helping teachers reimagine assessment
Canadian Assessment Centre
Episode: 22 - Outcomes-Based Grading & Artificial Intelligence in Education with Danielle Paloposki
Karley Alleyn
Educator and consultant focused on reimagining assessment practices.
Canadian Assessment Centre
Episode: 20 - Assessment Identity with Karley Alleyn
Natalie Vardabasso
Co-host of Assess THAT
Canadian Assessment Centre
Episode: 20 - Assessment Identity with Karley Alleyn
Tom Schimmer
Co-host of Assess THAT
Canadian Assessment Centre
Episode: 20 - Assessment Identity with Karley Alleyn
Gholdy Muhammad
Associate professor of literacy, language, and culture at the University of Illinois at Chicago, author of Cultivating Genius, An Equity Model for Culturally and Historically Responsive Literacy.
University of Illinois at Chicago
Episode: BONUS [TSP Classic] - Gholdy Muhammad (July 2022)
John Hattie
Emeritus Laureate Professor at the Melbourne Graduate School of Education
University of Melbourne
Episode: [TSP Classic] John Hattie (October 2022)
Dr. Yvette Jackson
Adjunct professor at Teachers College, Columbia University; author of The Pedagogy of Confidence
National Urban Alliance for Effective Education
Episode: [TSP Classic] Yvette Jackson (May 2021)
Zaretta Hammond
National consultant and author of 'Culturally Responsive Teaching and the Brain', promoting effective engagement in diverse classrooms.
Episode: [TSP Classic] Zaretta Hammond (June 2022)

Hosts

Tom Schimmer
Co-host of Assess THAT with Nat and Canadian Assessment Centre founder; recognized expert in grading, assessment design, and equity.
Natalie Vardabasso
Co-host of Assess THAT; equity-focused educator and consultant with expertise in standards-based learning and student agency.

Reviews

4.8 out of 5 stars from 100 ratings
  • 🔥 This podcast

    Love this podcast and what both Tom and Nat stand for. Equity for students through assessment, feedback, grading , and learning.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    FutureReadyTeaching
    United Statesa year ago
  • One of my favourite education podcasts

    Tom Schimmer Podcast is one of my favourites to listen to because I learn so much that challenges my thinking, gives me different perspectives & insights, and makes me a better person & educator. I love how the guest is sandwiched between two sections where Tom openly shares his views on various topics. Highly recommend!

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    @LiviaChanL
    Canada3 years ago
  • Reporting Order June 7

    Thank you for the bonus episode on the new reporting order. I’ve shared with everyone I could think of including senior staff at the district, other principals, teachers, support staff, and parents. Fantastic and absolutely nailed it yet again.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    greengirlyyc
    Canada3 years ago
  • Love Assessment Corner

    This podcast teaches me something every time I listen. Love the personal stories from an experienced educator, the amazing and noteworthy guests, and of course assessment corner each week, which always feels eerily relevant to my situation or problem. How do you know, Tom?

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    hiedibodnarchuk
    Canada4 years ago
  • Angora Amparo

    Out of all of the educational podcast out there Tom’s is the one that’s I have to listen to! His don’t @, then interview with guests and assessment corner are the perfect blend of thought provoking and enlightening information. He is as well an amazing interviewer and seems like he literally has been a radio/television in the way that he helps guest feel extremely comfortable.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    It's a process
    United States4 years ago

Listeners Say

Key themes from listener reviews, highlighting what works and what could be improved about the show.

Guests bring deep expertise from education and assessment.
The show challenges conventional approaches with equity-centered, human-focused discussions.
Listeners praise the practical, take-away-ready strategies for grading and feedback.
Interviews are consistently high-quality and engaging.

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Talking Points

Recent interactions between the hosts and their guests.

29 - Lowering the Bar Isn’t Compassion: Rethinking Assessment and Care
Q: Where might you be inadvertently lowering expectations when what students actually need is clarity and support?
The hosts encourage reflection on how teachers may unintentionally lower expectations due to compassion, while emphasizing the importance of providing clarity and support instead.
28 - AI Didn’t Break Assessment; It Exposed It (and What That Means for Integrity)
Q: How do we know if a task requires thinking beyond recall when it can be completed by AI?
We need to ask whether tasks measure deeper understanding and thinking rather than just factual recall or surface-level synthesis.
28 - AI Didn’t Break Assessment; It Exposed It (and What That Means for Integrity)
Q: What is one way that AI has shown up in your life recently in a way that was either helpful, awkward, surprising, or maybe even uncomfortable?
AI has shown up as a helpful tool in curriculum design, especially in prompting for clarity and context when creating assessment rubrics.
26 - Motivation and Assessment: Designing the Conditions for Learning with Josh Ogilvie
Q: What are the non-negotiable principles for centering learning in a physical education class?
Josh highlighted that participation, effort, and compliance should be separated from learning outcomes, and teachers should focus on helping students learn meaningful skills rather than merely managing their participation.
26 - Motivation and Assessment: Designing the Conditions for Learning with Josh Ogilvie
Q: What does it mean to have emotionally intelligent assessment?
Emotional intelligence in assessment entails understanding how assessments impact students emotionally and creating an environment where assessments do not invoke anxiety or embarrassment for students, especially in a public setting like PE.

Audience Metrics

Listeners, social reach, demographics and more for this podcast.

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Frequently Asked Questions About Assess THAT with Tom & Nat!

What is Assess THAT with Tom & Nat! about and what kind of topics does it cover?

Two seasoned education experts explore assessment literacy, grading, feedback, and equity with a practical, human-centered lens. Episodes mix concrete strategies, real-world district examples, and big-picture thinking to help teachers and leaders translate research into actionable classroom improvements. From reimagining final exams to navigating AI and universal design, the show consistently aims to improve student learning while keeping the human side of education front and center. A notable strength is weaving storytelling with evidence-based practices, often challenging conventional norms to foster more equitable, effective assessment systems.

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These podcasts share a similar audience with Assess THAT with Tom & Nat!:

1. The Mel Robbins Podcast
2. Science of Reading: The Podcast
3. The Oprah Podcast
4. The Grading Podcast
5. Good Hang with Amy Poehler

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Assess THAT with Tom & Nat! launched 6 years ago and published 100 episodes to date. You can find more information about this podcast including rankings, audience demographics and engagement in our podcast database.

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What guests have appeared on Assess THAT with Tom & Nat!?

Recent guests on Assess THAT with Tom & Nat! include:

1. Josh Ogilvie
2. Danielle Paloposki
3. Karley Alleyn
4. Natalie Vardabasso
5. Tom Schimmer
6. Gholdy Muhammad
7. John Hattie
8. Dr. Yvette Jackson

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