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Artwork for Nonprofits Are Messy: Lessons in Leadership

Nonprofits Are Messy: Lessons in Leadership | Fundraising | Board Development | Communications

Joan Garry & Glennda Testone
Nonprofit Sector
Nonprofit Leadership
Fundraising
Leadership
Nonprofits
Nonprofit Leadership Lab
Social Justice
Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion
Nonprofit Management
Philanthropy
Strategic Planning
Community Engagement
Innovation
Funding Challenges
Nonprofit Fundraising
Self-Care
Capital Campaigns
Nonprofit Budgeting
Just Fund
Hunger

Nonprofits Are Messy is the podcast for nonprofit leaders navigating the real challenges of leadership, fundraising, governance, communications, and organizational growth. Hosted by Joan Garry and Glennda Testone, each episode features candid conversations, practical advice, and honest stories to help you lead with greater confidence through the messiness of nonprofit work.

PublishesTwice monthlyEpisodes263Founded11 years ago
Number of ListenersCategories
Non-ProfitBusinessManagement

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Artwork for Nonprofits Are Messy: Lessons in Leadership

Latest Episodes

What if greater nonprofit impact isn’t about doing more? Glennda Testone talks with Better Good author Scott M. Curran about focusing on what works and using what you already have more intentionally.

For many nonprofit leaders, unionization can feel deeply personal. Explore the questions, challenges, and realities of nonprofit unionization, and how leaders, staff, and boards can navigate the process while preserving trust, culture, and their org’... more

What if the goal isn’t simply to avoid burnout, but to learn how to burn on? Jim Collins joins Joan Garry to explore why some leaders stay energized for decades, what it means to stay “in frame,” and how to build a life around what matters most.

Most nonprofits know how to get people to pay attention. Fewer know how to turn that attention into lasting change. In this conversation, Rashad Robinson shares what makes the difference.

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Recent Guests

Scott M. Curran
Author of Better Good; nonprofit leadership expert
Author, Better Good; Nonprofit Leadership Lab member
Episode: Ep 260: How Can Nonprofits Do Better Good? Hint: Doing More Isn’t the Answer.
Bev Tillary
Expert guest with a pro-union labor background
Former ED / Interim ED at Brooklyn Movement Center
Episode: Ep 259: Nonprofit Unions: What Leaders, Staff, and Boards Need to Know with Bev Tillery
Jim Collins
Author and researcher focused on leadership and life purpose
Author of Good to Great, What to Make of a Life
Episode: Ep 258: Burn on vs. Burnout: A Conversation With Jim Collins About What Matters in Life
Rashad Robinson
Executive Director of Color of Change, longtime nonprofit leader and author
Color of Change
Episode: Ep 257: Presence ≠ Power: What Nonprofit Leaders Need to Know with Rashad Robinson
Mariah Monique
Sponsorship catalyst and corporate partnership strategist
The Sponsorship Catalyst
Episode: Ep 256: What are Corporate Sponsors Really Looking for From Nonprofits? with Mariah Monique
Dr. Kiki Ramsey
Positive Psychologist and CEO of the Positive Psychology Coaching and Diversity Institute
PCAD / Positive Psychology Coaching and Diversity Institute
Episode: Ep 254: Building Belonging When DEI Feels Like a Four-Letter Word with Dr Kiki Ramsey
Julia Gackenbach
nonprofit CRM expert; DonorPerfect contributor
DonorPerfect
Episode: Ep 252: CRM Matchmaking: How to Ensure the Right Fit for Your Nonprofit with Julia Gackenbach
Vu Le
Keynote speaker, blogger, founder of Nonprofit AF, author
Nonprofit AF/The Platypus Principle Book Author
Episode: Ep 251: Reimagining Nonprofits: The Uncomfortable Conversation We Need to Have with Vu Le
Emilia Gonzalez Avalos
Executive Director of Unidos Minnesota
Unidos Minnesota
Episode: Ep 250: The Power of Neighbors: A Leadership Story from Minneapolis with Emilia Gonzalez Avalos

Host

Joan Garry
Host of the show; nonprofit leadership expert; guides interview flow and explores leadership topics.

Reviews

4.6 out of 5 stars from 392 ratings
  • Excellent podcast!

    This was such a refreshing take on strategic planning and a great reminder that it doesn’t have to become a complicated document that sits untouched. I enjoyed listening to the episode, and the discussion around creating agile plans for smaller nonprofits was especially insightful.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    Mary Burruss
    United States4 months ago
  • Used to be fantastic

    Unfortunately, Joan cannot check her ego at the door anymore. She talks over guests, inserts her worldview, and boasts endlessly about her contributions. The guests are amazing. I only wish the interviewer would return to being amazing too.

    Apple Podcasts
    1
    DonorAdviceFun
    United Statesa year ago
  • I am just exploring the nonprofit sector. The conversations in these podcasts are enlightening and helpful. I think this will be helpful to me in making decisions about whether to move forward.

    Audible
    5
    K. Shea
    United States2 years ago
  • Just learning; valuable information here!

    I am just exploring the nonprofit sector. The conversations in these podcasts are enlightening and helpful. I think this will be helpful to me in making decisions about whether to move forward.

    Audible
    5
    K. Shea
    United States2 years ago
  • Brilliant!

    Joan is a deep thinker and takes a novel and strategic approach to solving problems. Joan's advice and thinking about all things nonprofit is some of the best!

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    libbyv55
    United States3 years ago

Listeners Say

Key themes from listener reviews, highlighting what works and what could be improved about the show.

Some listeners critique pacing and interruptions, but overall content is considered highly informative.
Guest-focused conversations frequently praised for practical insights and actionable takeaways.
Hosts and guests are described as industry experts delivering high-value nonprofit guidance.

Chart Rankings

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Talking Points

Recent interactions between the hosts and their guests.

Ep 260: How Can Nonprofits Do Better Good? Hint: Doing More Isn’t the Answer.
Q: How did you deal with the bad as you were writing this book and still try to get people to focus on the good?
By cultivating greater awareness and intentionality, and acknowledging that our biology predisposes us to feel good when we see others doing good; this becomes a flywheel that sustains action despite negative headlines.
Ep 260: How Can Nonprofits Do Better Good? Hint: Doing More Isn’t the Answer.
Q: So Scott, could you start by just sharing, why did you write this book right now? How are you defining good? And to the title of the book, how are you defining better good?
The book reframes doing good from a mindset that more is needed to a focus on awareness, intentionality, and acting on the good you already do. Better Good means leveraging the Goldilocks Zone where passion and proficiency overlap, and recognizing that we don't need external changes to start making a difference today.
Ep 258: Burn on vs. Burnout: A Conversation With Jim Collins About What Matters in Life
Q: Can you share what you wish you had included in the book or what you would add with more time?
I'd add more on how people get knocked out of frame by promotions and organizational structures, and how crucial it is to preserve alignment with encodings even as one's role changes.
Ep 257: Presence ≠ Power: What Nonprofit Leaders Need to Know with Rashad Robinson
Q: What guidance does the author offer for dealing with backlash and sustaining progress?
Expect backlash as part of progress, stay focused on building power, and do not wait for a perfect moment or an external referee; maintain momentum through concrete actions and infrastructure.
Ep 257: Presence ≠ Power: What Nonprofit Leaders Need to Know with Rashad Robinson
Q: How should nonprofit leaders approach the idea of infrastructure in their work?
Infrastructure is the practical backbone that enables strategy to be implemented; without it, even great ideas stall. Leaders must build and fund the roads, networks, and processes that connect plans to action.

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What is This Podcast about and what kind of topics does it cover?

The show centers on practical leadership for nonprofits, covering leadership development, governance, fundraising, and strategic planning with a pragmatic, experience-driven lens. Across episodes, listeners hear candid discussions about board dynamics, staff management, revenue diversification, DEI evolution, and partnerships with corporations, unions, and donors. Notable qualities include hands-on guidance, real-world examples, and guest expertise from sector leaders, making it a helpful resource for executives, directors, and board members aiming to strengthen their organizations while navigating the complex nonprofit landscape.

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1. Fixable
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this podcast launched 11 years ago and published 263 episodes to date. You can find more information about this podcast including rankings, audience demographics and engagement in our podcast database.

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What guests have appeared on this podcast?

Recent guests on this podcast include:

1. Scott M. Curran
2. Bev Tillary
3. Jim Collins
4. Rashad Robinson
5. Mariah Monique
6. Dr. Kiki Ramsey
7. Julia Gackenbach
8. Vu Le

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