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The Long Game with Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer

Vox Media Podcast Network
Iran
United States
China
Russia
Venezuela
National Security
Greenland
Ukraine
Trump Administration
Taiwan
Donald Trump
Israel
Saudi Arabia
Artificial Intelligence
Ukraine War
U.s.-China Relations
Strait Of Hormuz
Iran Nuclear Program
World Cup
NATO

The Long Game is a weekly national security podcast hosted by Jake Sullivan, President Biden’s National Security Advisor, and Jon Finer, his Principal Deputy—senior aides who sat in on the classified Presidential Daily Brief each morning and translated raw intelligence into policy advice. Each week, Jake and Jon will pull back the curtain on how power really works helping you make sense of the nat... more

PublishesWeeklyEpisodes56Foundeda year ago
Number of ListenersCategories
News CommentaryGovernmentNews

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Artwork for The Long Game

Latest Episodes

Javier Blas, Bloomberg Opinion’s energy and commodities columnist, joins Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer to explain why the Iran war has produced an oil market few expected: crude prices hovering around $100 a barrel while tankers are braving missile att... more

Anne Applebaum, Pulitzer Prize-winning author and staff writer at The Atlantic, joins Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer to discuss how far-right ideology and private profit have become intertwined in the Trump administration’s approach to the world; the su... more

PHOTO CREDIT

China experts Jessica Chen Weiss, David M. Lampton Professor of China Studies at Johns Hopkins SAIS, and Julian Gewirtz, fellow at Harvard’s Belfer Center and senior research scholar at Columbia University, join Jake Sullivan and Jon Fi... more

Julia Curlee, a former CIA analyst and acting senior director at the National Security Council, joins Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer to explain why she believes America’s intelligence system is being weakened from within.

Curlee also discusses her expe... more

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Recent Guests

Anne Applebaum
Pulitzer Prize–winning author and staff writer at The Atlantic
The Atlantic
Episode: Anne Applebaum on the Grifters and Ideologues Reshaping US Foreign Policy
Jessica Chen Weiss
David M. Lampton Professor of China Studies at Johns Hopkins SAIS; former State Department Policy Planning Staff member
Johns Hopkins University SAIS
Episode: The U.S.–China Relationship Is Moving in Two Directions
Julian Gewirtz
Senior fellow at Harvard's Belfer Center; Senior Research Scholar at Columbia; author
Harvard Belfer Center; Columbia University
Episode: The U.S.–China Relationship Is Moving in Two Directions
Julia Curlee
Former CIA intelligence director, acting senior director; daily intelligence briefer for Vice President Pence; public service fellow at Lawfare
Lawfare; former CIA and NSC
Episode: U.S. Intelligence Under Assault and the High-Stakes AI Race With China
Bill McRaven
Retired Admiral, former commander of US Special Operations Command and Joint Special Operations Command
U.S. Navy
Episode: 25 Years After 9/11: Admiral McRaven’s Warning for America
Patrick Radden Keefe
Premier investigative storyteller, staff writer at The New Yorker
The New Yorker
Episode: Corruption in a Shameless Age (with Patrick Radden Keefe)
Radosław Sikorski
Poland's Deputy Prime Minister and Foreign Minister (Radek Sikorski)
Poland government
Episode: Can Europe Defend Itself Without America? Radek Sikorski on NATO & Ukraine
Jocelyn Benson
Secretary of State, Michigan; Democratic candidate for governor
Michigan Department of State
Episode: Trump’s Election Playbook, Explained by Jocelyn Benson
Heather Cox Richardson
Historian and author of Letters From An American
Historian/Public Intellectual
Episode: Heather Cox Richardson on Democracy, Alliances, and America's Future

Hosts

Jake Sullivan
Host of The Long Game, senior national security official with experience in top U.S. administrations.
Jon Finer
Co-host; former White House deputy national security adviser and senior policy official.

Reviews

4.8 out of 5 stars from 915 ratings
  • Excellent Foreign Policy Podcast. Listening to Jake Sullivan and Jon Finer analyze current, and sometimes not so current, issues in foreign policy makes me weep for my country when I compare them with the louts, lowlifes and idiots currently in charge.

    Podcast Addict
    5
    MSC
    a month ago
  • I'm honestly very surprised that these two have decided to make a podcast, but I think myself as a lay person is incredibly lucky that they decided to. It's of incredible quality, and I find it amazing to be able to hear conversations like this from those that have had to have them at the highest level of our government.

    Podcast Addict
    5
    fdiengott
    a month ago
  • Excellent podcast on US and foreign politics.

    Podcast Addict
    5
    Podhound
    a month ago
  • Masterful analysis

    I’m Canadian but appreciate the in depth analysis done by the hosts. In the rare episodes where they discuss Canada they know the internal issues intimately, which gives me confidence in their knowledge of other countries.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    drouselle
    Canadaa month ago
  • My goto intelligent source for wtf is happening

    Podcast Addict
    5
    Ken W.
    a month ago

Listeners Say

Key themes from listener reviews, highlighting what works and what could be improved about the show.

The show's Red Team/Blue Team debates provide balanced, nonpartisan discussions that attract serious interest from sponsors and guests.
Guests are often distinguished practitioners offering firsthand perspectives on diplomacy and security.
Listeners appreciate expert analysis and interviews with high-profile policymakers and historians.

Chart Rankings

How this podcast ranks in the Apple Podcasts, Spotify and YouTube charts.

Apple Podcasts
#22
United States/News/News Commentary
Apple Podcasts
#144
United States/News
Apple Podcasts
#13
Canada/News/News Commentary
Apple Podcasts
#18
United Kingdom/News/News Commentary
Apple Podcasts
#109
Canada/News
Apple Podcasts
#190
United Kingdom/News

Talking Points

Recent interactions between the hosts and their guests.

The U.S.–China Relationship Is Moving in Two Directions
Q: What should be the core frame for U.S.-China competition going forward?
Competition should be managed to prevent conflict, preserve areas for cooperation, and focus on shared global challenges like AI risk while avoiding zero-sum thinking on issues like Taiwan.
The U.S.–China Relationship Is Moving in Two Directions
Q: Do you think that this meeting will advance a durable detente?
They see a real, albeit fragile, opportunity to move toward a more durable, long-term stabilization or detente, but it will require sustained, structured engagement and not rely on a single summit or a handful of optics.
Can Europe Defend Itself Without America? Radek Sikorski on NATO & Ukraine
Q: How does Ukraine get to victory and what would a secure, resilient Ukraine look like in practice?
Sikorski emphasizes Ukraine's initiative in the war, sustained European support, and the importance of maintaining a drawn-out conflict where Ukraine can leverage drones and innovation while Europe pressures Russia economically and militarily for a favorable end state.
Can Europe Defend Itself Without America? Radek Sikorski on NATO & Ukraine
Q: Since the end of the Cold War, Radek, has there been a more challenging time for Europe? How do you see the picture today?
He argues Europe has faced unprecedented tests but has not lost its cohesion, highlighting high defense spending, EU funding for defense, and ongoing reindustrialization, while noting the lack of single command but emphasizing Europe's capacity to adapt and defend itself with or without full US involvement.
Heather Cox Richardson on Democracy, Alliances, and America's Future
Q: What does the old postwar order mean for America today?
It signals that the traditional, centralized form of American leadership and the rules that governed international relations are in flux, requiring new ways of organizing coalitions and diplomacy.

Audience Metrics

Listeners, social reach, demographics and more for this podcast.

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Frequently Asked Questions About The Long Game

What is The Long Game about and what kind of topics does it cover?

The show provides in-depth, expert-level analysis of global security, diplomacy, and national policy, featuring long-form conversations with war and diplomacy veterans, historians, and investigative journalists. Episodes often blend historical context with current events, exploring topics from oligarch-financed power networks to NATO cohesion, U.S. foreign policy, and diplomacy in high-stakes scenarios. A standout is the Red Team/Blue Team debate format and guest roster, which includes former diplomats, top policymakers, and renowned authors, offering practical takeaways for professionals and decision-makers. The program is likely to appeal to listeners who want high-level, nonpartisan insight into how power actually operates on the world s... more

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Which podcasts are similar to The Long Game?

These podcasts share a similar audience with The Long Game:

1. Stay Tuned with Preet
2. The Ezra Klein Show
3. Raging Moderates with Scott Galloway and Jessica Tarlov
4. On with Kara Swisher
5. The David Frum Show

How many episodes of The Long Game are there?

The Long Game launched a year ago and published 56 episodes to date. You can find more information about this podcast including rankings, audience demographics and engagement in our podcast database.

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What guests have appeared on The Long Game?

Recent guests on The Long Game include:

1. Anne Applebaum
2. Jessica Chen Weiss
3. Julian Gewirtz
4. Julia Curlee
5. Bill McRaven
6. Patrick Radden Keefe
7. Radosław Sikorski
8. Jocelyn Benson

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