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Messy Social Work

Messy Social Work
Social Work
Child Protection
Kinship Care
Community Engagement
Mental Health
Relational Activism
Trauma
Family Group Conference
Community Support
Lived Experience
Adoption
Meditation
Foster Care
Family Group Conferencing
Parenting
Poverty
Participation
Children's Rights
Domestic Abuse
Writing

Welcome to the Messy Social Work podcast. The hosts are Richard Devine and Tim Fisher. Check out our website here: www.relationalactivism.com/

PublishesWeeklyEpisodes105Founded4 years ago
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Social SciencesScience

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Artwork for Messy Social Work

Latest Episodes

In this episode of the Messy Social Work podcast, we begin with a conversation with Natasha Dube, before Rich and Tim discuss Liz Bosanquet’s new book, Systemic Social Work Practice. The discussion explores how systemic ideas can move beyond theory a... more

In this second bonus episode, Rich, Tim and Charlotte build directly on Part 1, turning their attention to the four remaining ideas from Rich’s blog on resilience in social work and exploring how these play out in practice.

The conversation moves be... more

This episode explores time management as both a practical challenge and a lived experience in social work. Rich shares techniques such as Stephen Covey’s urgent and important quadrants, Cal Newport’s time blocking and the difference between deep and ... more

This bonus episode picks up where the previous conversation left off. Rich and Tim return to six years of journals to explore the next three themes that emerged — the ones that didn’t fit neatly, resolve cleanly, or offer easy lessons.

They begin wi... more

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Recent Guests

Jamie Crabb
Psychotherapist and writer of Care and Being Seen in the Presence of the Enigmatic
Independent researcher/psychotherapist
Episode: Rich and Tim speak to Psychotherapist, Jamie Crabb on suffering, care, and staying with what we don’t yet understand.
Janet Kay
Kinship carer, former social worker and lecturer, OBE recipient
Kinship (UK charity)
Episode: Rich and Tim speak to Janet Kay OBE about her experiences as a social worker, adoptive parent and kinship carer
Jonathan Scourfield
Professor of Social Work at Cardiff University
Cardiff University
Episode: Rich and Tim speak to Professor Jonathan Scourfield on what the largest-ever Family Group Conference study reveals
Juliette Davies
Parent from Building Bridges, advocate and former client of the child protection system
Building Bridges
Episode: Rich and Tim speak to Juliette Davies about addiction, domestic abuse and her recovery journey
Ethan St Pierre
Care-experienced individual with lived experience of foster care, addiction, and recovery
Independent speaker / trainer on trauma-informed practice
Episode: Rich and Tim speak to Ethan St Pierre about growing up in care, addiction and being reborn in a cemetery
Mark Hopfenbeck
Open Dialogue trainer and international ambassador; head of training at the Open Dialogue Centre in Melbourne
Open Dialogue Centre, Melbourne
Episode: Rich and Tim talk to Mark Hopfenbeck about the transformative possibilities of Open Dialogue.
Mina Fazel
Professor of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry at Oxford University
University of Oxford (Department of Psychiatry)
Episode: Connecting Research: Why young people don't access mental health support
Seana McDermott
Child in care social worker
Bath and North East Somerset
Episode: Rich and Tim talk to Seana McDermott (Social Worker for Children in Care) about relational practice, moral injury and making a difference
Anna Harvey
Senior clinical lecturer at Tavistock and Portman; expert on psychoanalysis in social work
Tavistock and Portman NHS Foundation Trust
Episode: Rich and Tim hear about handstands, breakdance battles, and the unconscious: Dr Anna Harvey on what shapes social work

Hosts

Richard Devine
Host with a background in social work and relational activism; engages in trauma-informed and rights-focused discussions.
Tim Fisher
Co-host focusing on participation, community, and relational approaches in social work.

Reviews

4.9 out of 5 stars from 56 ratings
  • So glad you’re both back for 2026

    There is nothing better than raw honesty and I loved listening to your reflections in this episode, I love the commitment to ‘space’, and I hope you find it (and selfishly hope that the podcast will continue to exist in between the spaciousness). It’s such an amazing resource and the balance between your lovely friendship, social work chats and reflections is ideal for anyone with an interest in the sector.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    bookish2543
    United Kingdom4 months ago
  • Weaponising empathy and professional curiosity

    Words fail to describe my feelings about this episode. I listened today to Lads like Us , and Danny and Mike are inspirational. I have already passed on the episode with others (including to a friend who was interacting with a distraught child yesterday in out of school education) to share the wealth of wisdom, experience and insight. I will continue to share to motivate and inspire others. Thank you Rich, Mike and Danny…you are amazing, brilliant individuals.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    Ulongtime
    United Kingdoma year ago
  • Learning so much from all of these podcasts

    Absolutely recommend

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    Noralene
    United Kingdom2 years ago
  • Excellent podcasts

    Really great podcast! I learned a lot, especially from the authority and power in child protection podcast. This podcast was actually the jumping board for my capstone work. Thank you

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    Mharsbarrr
    Australia3 years ago
  • Always provokes learning

    Qualified in Sept 22 with 14+ years past experience of working with people in various statutory and voluntary roles, and this podcast still prompts new thoughts.

    Please can you consider doing something around ‘home conditions’ the challenges of quantifying, challenging parents and drawing the line.

    Great work.

    Chris

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    Redman101986
    United Kingdom3 years ago

Listeners Say

Key themes from listener reviews, highlighting what works and what could be improved about the show.

Relatable and learning-focused with strong ethical grounding.
Brave, insightful, and continuously useful for students and practitioners.
High-impact discussions that connect theory to real-world practice.
Thoughtful, honest, and deeply relevant to social work practice.

Chart Rankings

How this podcast ranks in the Apple Podcasts, Spotify and YouTube charts.

Talking Points

Recent interactions between the hosts and their guests.

Rich and Tim speak to Professor Jonathan Scourfield on what the largest-ever Family Group Conference study reveals
Q: What were the main findings about participation quality and outcomes?
Participation quality did influence some outcomes, notably family satisfaction and, in the longer term, adult well-being, but effects varied across measures and were not universal across all outcomes.
Rich and Tim speak to Professor Jonathan Scourfield on what the largest-ever Family Group Conference study reveals
Q: Why publish a pre-print rather than a full peer-reviewed article yet?
Pre-prints enable rapid sharing of results, allow early scrutiny, and reflect timely interest in the evolving legal context around family group decision making in England.
Rich and Tim speak to Professor Jonathan Scourfield on what the largest-ever Family Group Conference study reveals
Q: What was the intention behind the study and its design across multiple time points?
The aim was to examine variability in how FGC works across different welfare stages and circumstances, using standardized measures and multiple time points to see how participation quality relates to outcomes while controlling for baseline differences.
Rich and Tim speak to Juliette Davies about addiction, domestic abuse and her recovery journey
Q: If Juliette's children listen in the future, what would she want them to understand?
She would want them to know that her love for them was constant, and that the changes she made were about healing herself to create a better life for them; she expresses gratitude for how life is now and the possibility of a happy family life.
Rich and Tim speak to Juliette Davies about addiction, domestic abuse and her recovery journey
Q: What did Rich learn from Juliette's story about what social workers should understand about addiction?
Rich emphasizes that addiction is often a long-standing condition tied to trauma and that consistent, empathetic support is essential; social workers benefit from recognizing addiction as a health issue rather than a mere moral failing and from seeing recovery as a long-term process.

Audience Metrics

Listeners, social reach, demographics and more for this podcast.

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Frequently Asked Questions About Messy Social Work

What is Messy Social Work about and what kind of topics does it cover?

Relationally grounded discussions mix deep-dive interviews with practitioners, researchers, and critics of child protection, social work ethics, and trauma-informed practice. Episodes frequently center on lived experience, relational approaches to care, and systemic reforms, paired with pragmatic policy takes and reflective banter. Notable strengths include candid storytelling that pairs personal journeys with professional analysis, plus a willingness to scrutinize power dynamics, funding and policy changes in child welfare. This show likely appeals to listeners who want human-centered social work insights, practical implications for practice, and thoughtful critique of current systems.

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How many listeners does Messy Social Work get?

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Which podcasts are similar to Messy Social Work?

These podcasts share a similar audience with Messy Social Work:

1. Strangers on a Bench
2. How Do You Cope?
3. The Louis Theroux Podcast
4. Happy Place
5. Woman's Hour

How many episodes of Messy Social Work are there?

Messy Social Work launched 4 years ago and published 105 episodes to date. You can find more information about this podcast including rankings, audience demographics and engagement in our podcast database.

How do I contact Messy Social Work?

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What guests have appeared on Messy Social Work?

Recent guests on Messy Social Work include:

1. Jamie Crabb
2. Janet Kay
3. Jonathan Scourfield
4. Juliette Davies
5. Ethan St Pierre
6. Mark Hopfenbeck
7. Mina Fazel
8. Seana McDermott

To view more recent guests and their details, simply upgrade your Rephonic account. You'll also get access to a typical guest profile to help you decide if the show is worth pitching.

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