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Artwork for Just Scratching the Surface

Just Scratching the Surface

Kaleb Abbott and Andrew Pucker
Ocular Surface Disease
Intense Pulsed Light
Dry Eye Practice
Mucins
Neurotrophic Keratitis
Artificial Tears
Harrow
Dry Eye Disease
Insurance
Lubricating Drops
Ocular Surface
Persistent Corneal Epithelial Defects
Medical Affairs
Location/market
Tear Film / Natural Tears
FDA Monograph
Aqueous Deficient Dry Eye
Lacrimal Gland / Tear Nutrients
Corneal Sensitivity Testing
Esthesiometers

Conversations on ocular surface disease care that address real-world clinical questions, hosted by optometrists Kaleb Abbott and Andrew Pucker with a new guest expert each episode. Updated monthly.

PublishesMonthlyEpisodes7Founded7 months ago
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MedicineHealth & FitnessLife SciencesScience

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Artwork for Just Scratching the Surface

Latest Episodes

Hosts Kaleb Abbott and Andrew Pucker welcome renowned ophthalmologist Penny Asbell to discuss the key updates from the recently published TFOS DEWS III report, the latest international consensus document on dry eye disease. The report spans over 300 ... more

This episode, Drs. Abbott and Pucker begin an occasional series called “Industry Insights,” welcoming guest Natalie Nguyen, OD, Senior Director of Medical Affairs at Harrow, to discuss what it’s like for optometrists to transition from clinical pract... more

Kaleb Abbott and Andrew Pucker are joined by Jeff Banas, an OD from Wisconsin specializing in glaucoma and dry eye, to discuss neurotrophic keratitis (NK).

The trio begin by trying to clarify what, specifically, NK is and how it develops. While clas... more

Mucins play an integral role in ocular surface health. They are the secret ingredient that gives the aqueous its viscosity and moisturizing properties. They entrap pathogens in the tear film to protect the eye. And they provide the glycocalyx anchor ... more

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Recent Guests

Penny Asbell
Renowned ophthalmologist, professor, and clinical researcher; lead author associated with DOIS 3
Memphis, Tennessee
Episode: DEWS III Decoded: What Clinicians Need to Know
Natalie Nguyen
Senior Director of Medical Affairs at Harrow
Harrow
Episode: The Leap from Clinic to Industry
Jeff Banas
Optometrist at Eye Centers of Racine and Kenosha (Wisconsin)
Eye Centers of Racine and Kenosha
Episode: Neurotrophic Keratitis: From Diagnosis to Treatment
Anna Fitchner
Director of the Indiana University Dry Eye Clinic; researcher focused on mucins
Indiana University Dry Eye Clinic
Episode: Mucins – The Sticky Secret Protecting Your Eyes
Ada Noh
Optometrist and founder of a dry eye specialty practice in Little Rock
Noh Eyes
Episode: Building a Dry Eye Practice
Milton Hom
Optometrist in private practice; guest on topic of artificial vs human tears
Canyon City Eye Care, Southern California
Episode: Natural Tears vs. Artificial Tears
Cory Lappin
Dry eye and ocular surface disease expert; clinical lead for IPL
Dry Eye Center of Ohio; Optometric Physician (editor)
Episode: IPL Unfiltered: Separating Fact from Fiction

Hosts

Kaleb Abbott
Host of Just Scratching the Surface
Andrew Pucker
Co-host of Just Scratching the Surface

Chart Rankings

How this podcast ranks in the Apple Podcasts, Spotify and YouTube charts.

Talking Points

Recent interactions between the hosts and their guests.

DEWS III Decoded: What Clinicians Need to Know
Q: How does the new DOES 3 definition differentiate dry eye from previous definitions, and how should clinicians adjust their approach?
DOES 3 expands the definition from tear-film-centric to a broader ocular surface homeostasis concept, guiding clinicians to assess tear film, ocular surface integrity, and neurosensory factors, while using the shorter OSDI-6 for efficient patient screening and combining it with simple ocular surface tests to tailor treatment.
Neurotrophic Keratitis: From Diagnosis to Treatment
Q: How do you know clinically if somebody has reduced corneal sensation?
Two main approaches: a quantitative measure with devices like the Cochet-Bonnet esthesiometer and a qualitative bedside method using a cotton wisp to test multiple corneal sectors, documenting baseline and comparing sides to assess reduction.
Natural Tears vs. Artificial Tears
Q: Do current artificial tears truly mimic natural tears?
No; although some products claim improvements, none fully replicate the complex composition of natural tears, which include thousands of proteins and lipids, making perfect replication difficult. The episode discusses how formulations are evolving but still fall short of the natural tear film.
Natural Tears vs. Artificial Tears
Q: What are artificial tears and rewetting drops, and how are they regulated?
Artificial tears are products intended to treat dry eye, while rewetting drops are designed to relieve contact lens discomfort; the FDA monograph defines allowable ingredients, and products using these ingredients can bypass full drug trials. This regulatory distinction is old, and there's discussion about modern formulations not perfectly fitting the monograph.

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Frequently Asked Questions About Just Scratching the Surface

What is Just Scratching the Surface about and what kind of topics does it cover?

A clinically focused conversation series centered on ocular surface disease and dry eye care, hosted by two optometrists who bring in a rotating slate of subject-matter experts. Episodes typically unpack a specific condition or technology—ranging from neurotrophic keratitis and mucin biology to practical practice-building and treatment modalities like artificial versus natural tears and IPL for meibomian gland dysfunction—with a strong emphasis on real-world workflow, patient education, and evidence-based tips. The format blends clinical context, trial insights, and practical anecdotes from clinic life, making it useful for clinicians seeking actionable guidance, as well as for vendors looking to understand how innovations transfer to every... more

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These podcasts share a similar audience with Just Scratching the Surface:

1. To the Point
2. Defocus Media Eyecare and Optometry Podcast Network
3. EYE OWN A BUSINESS
4. The 20/20 Podcast
5. The Optometry Success Podcast

How many episodes of Just Scratching the Surface are there?

Just Scratching the Surface launched 7 months ago and published 7 episodes to date. You can find more information about this podcast including rankings, audience demographics and engagement in our podcast database.

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What guests have appeared on Just Scratching the Surface?

Recent guests on Just Scratching the Surface include:

1. Penny Asbell
2. Natalie Nguyen
3. Jeff Banas
4. Anna Fitchner
5. Ada Noh
6. Milton Hom
7. Cory Lappin

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