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Artwork for New Law Order

New Law Order

TalksOnLaw
Executive Orders
Legal Industry
Trump Administration
Litigation Finance
Profitability Trends
Law Firms
Unconstitutionality
Political Affiliations
Quinn Emanuel
Burford Capital
Time Warner
Law
Legal Technology
Income Partners
Legal Crisis
Bill Of Rights
Corporate Law
Paul Weiss
Litigation
Transactional Law

New Law Order is a podcast and limited interview series about the coming shake-up in legal services. Hosted by lawyer and TalksOnLaw founder Joel Cohen and Yale Law School Professor John Morley, the show interrogates the technologies, business models, and incentives quietly—and not so quietly—rewiring the legal industry. Each episode is a candid conversation with someone actively changing how law ... more

PublishesWeeklyEpisodes6Founded2 months ago
Number of ListenersCategories
EducationBusiness

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Artwork for New Law Order

Latest Episodes

Law firms like to describe themselves as simple partnerships. Economically, they behave more like highly tuned performance machines balancing profit, talent, leverage, and now — technological disruption. In this episode of New Law Order, Joel Cohen a... more

Artificial intelligence is usually sold as productivity: faster research, faster drafting, faster answers. In this episode of New Law Order, Yale Law professor Scott Shapiro explains that the real story is power. If the law is a system for coordinati... more

What happens when you stop treating litigation as a cost center—and start treating it like capital? In this episode of New Law Order, Joel Cohen and John Morley sit down with Chris Bogart, co-founder and CEO of Burford Capital, to unpack how legal fi... more

John Quinn proved the legal industry orthodoxy wrong. In a world obsessed with the "full-service" law firm model—where litigation can feel like a service arm for lucrative corporate retainers—Quinn bet the house on a radical idea: a global firm dedic... more

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Recent Guests

Gretta Rusanow
Managing Director and Head of Advisory Services at Citibank
Citibank
Episode: The New Math of Law Firm Profitability
Scott Shapiro
Professor of Law and Philosophy at Yale Law School, founder of the AI lab at Yale Law School, and co-founder of an AI legal technology company.
Yale Law School
Episode: Law as Code: The AI Power Shift
Chris Bogart
CEO and co-founder of Burford Capital, former general counsel of Time Warner
Burford Capital
Episode: Litigation as an Asset Class
John Quinn
Founding partner of Quinn Emanuel and influential figure in litigation.
Quinn Emanuel
Episode: Building a World Litigation Empire
Brad Karp
Chairman of Paul Weiss
Paul Weiss
Episode: Law According to Karp
Jeffrey Toobin
Author and journalist, staff writer for The New Yorker.
Episode: Bending the Knee – Toobin on the Trump Executive Orders

Hosts

Joel Cohen
Host of New Law Order and TalksOnLaw founder, specializing in legal innovation.
John Morley
Co-host of New Law Order and Yale Law School Professor, focusing on legal education and industry trends.

Reviews

5.0 out of 5 stars from 10 ratings
  • Thoughtful and Impeccably Timed

    The interviewers are sharp and consistently ask thoughtful, well-researched questions. The guest list is stacked and impeccably timed. Interviewing Brad Karp in January 2026 speaks volumes about the relevance and caliber of this podcast.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    Craig 1234566789
    United States11 days ago
  • Great law insider pod

    The Karp interview was great. Also I’d never heard any of that backstory about the executive orders.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    1102jane
    United Statesa month ago
  • Great show. Extremely biased.

    I’m one of the co-hosts so don’t take my word for it, but my cohost John is amazing and our guests are better than we deserve.

    Also I tried to ask questions we want answered and not just what the guest wanted to share. Shoot us feedback at the email on file and any other good reviews help us get discovered.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    JC NYC 1332
    United Statesa month ago
  • Jeffrey Toobin Episode

    Listened to the first episode with Jeffrey Toobin. The discussion of the exec orders against major firms was unusually clear about both the constitutional issues and the practical risks. Also, Toobin and the hosts were pretty funny. Looking forward to what’s next.

    Apple Podcasts
    5
    CEM1221
    United Statesa month ago

Listeners Say

Key themes from listener reviews, highlighting what works and what could be improved about the show.

The combination of humor and insight keeps discussions both engaging and insightful for a professional audience.
Listeners appreciate the sharp, well-researched questions posed by the hosts.
The guest selections are noted for their timeliness and relevance to current legal affairs.

Chart Rankings

How this podcast ranks in the Apple Podcasts, Spotify and YouTube charts.

Apple Podcasts
#109
Indonesia/Business

Talking Points

Recent interactions between the hosts and their guests.

The New Math of Law Firm Profitability
Q: What is the logic of having income partners especially if they are the lowest contributors to profitability?
It's mainly about talent retention, ensuring top talent who might leave for competitors have a path to success and can develop a business case as partners.
The New Math of Law Firm Profitability
Q: What is driving the incredible sustained year-over-year increase in revenue?
It's a combination of increased billing rates and the top firms capturing more market share, with a noted 3.5% increase in revenue for the top 15 firms compared to the industry average of 1.6%.
The New Math of Law Firm Profitability
Q: What are the trends you are seeing in revenue?
The industry has experienced a lot more volatility but has overall done well, with an average annual revenue growth of around 8.5% over the past five years.
Law as Code: The AI Power Shift
Q: How can universities contribute to the development of legal AI?
Universities can leverage their vast knowledge and training material to build AI models that serve social good.
Law as Code: The AI Power Shift
Q: What does the increasing complexity in law mean for future legal practice?
As the law becomes more intricate, AI can help manage this complexity and improve the efficiency of legal processes.

Audience Metrics

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Frequently Asked Questions About New Law Order

What is New Law Order about and what kind of topics does it cover?

The content of this podcast predominantly explores the significant shifts occurring in the legal services industry, with discussions centering on new technologies, outside market pressures, and innovative business models. It features in-depth conversations with legal professionals and thought leaders who are actively influencing the landscape of how legal work is approached. Highlights include discussions on how litigation finance is evolving, the implications of AI in law, and reflections on executive orders that challenge traditional legal practice. Overall, it offers a blend of insight and humor, making complex legal topics accessible and engaging to a broad audience.

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Which podcasts are similar to New Law Order?

These podcasts share a similar audience with New Law Order:

1. Law, disrupted
2. Original Jurisdiction
3. Divided Argument
4. WSJ Opinion: Potomac Watch
5. FT News Briefing

How many episodes of New Law Order are there?

New Law Order launched 2 months ago and published 6 episodes to date. You can find more information about this podcast including rankings, audience demographics and engagement in our podcast database.

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What guests have appeared on New Law Order?

Recent guests on New Law Order include:

1. Gretta Rusanow
2. Scott Shapiro
3. Chris Bogart
4. John Quinn
5. Brad Karp
6. Jeffrey Toobin

To view more recent guests and their details, simply upgrade your Rephonic account. You'll also get access to a typical guest profile to help you decide if the show is worth pitching.

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